2Gbps slow speeds
Hello, I recently upgraded my modem to the pw8. A couple days after they shipped it, a cox rep called and convinced me to upgrade from 1Gbps to 2Gbps speeds. Problem is, I plugged straight in with e...
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To the best of my knowledge, cox only runs fiber to the box on the property line. Then runs coax from there to the box on the outside of house, which they call hybrid fiber. From that box, mine has coax into the house and modem. Not sure if they ran cat6 from that box to the modem? Confused at how else he could have his internet coming in through an rj45. But there should be a coax option coming out of that box anchored to the house, unless it's different in different areas. Could be an option to connect coax to the box and yank it up through the house?
I think what you are talking about is radio frequency over glass(RFoG). There are different kinds of implementations, but most is fiber into your house which goes into a node and then uses coax to connect to a DOCSIS modem/gateway in your house. wilsons521 mentioned they had ethernet going into their Panoramic device, which means RFoG wasn't used. Instead, I think they are using FTTP which is fiber to a optical network terminal(ONT) and then ethernet to the router/gateway. There is a option in the gateway that changes the WAN from the coax connection to ethernet port 4 on the gateway. Some people live in a area which is called brownstone. This is when both fiber and coax is available. They use RFoG for TV service(QAM) and FTTP with a ONT for internet. Most areas though are either one or the other and TV service is only provided by IPTV boxes if FTTP. Either way, that coax would only be for TV and isn't compatible with 2Gbps service. Also, the upload is capped to 30Mbps I think, when normal HFC and FTTP can be up to 100Mbps.
I used all 8 of my brain cells to try to follow what you just said. I think I got most of it. I only have 1 coax line coming out of my "node" and it runs into a generic splitter and has 2 coming out; 1 for tv and 1 for internet. They are interchangeable. So maybe there's a little bit of hope for him if he can run coax from the node instead of ethernet?
I don't believe they have a node. If they did, they would have coax going into their gateway, not ethernet. Node turns fiber into coax. ONT turns fiber into ethernet. Even if they lived in a area that had both fiber(FTTP) and coax(HFC or RFoG), only one can be used for internet and fiber is far superior. Higher upload, less latency, and less likely to have problems.
Just for some context, Comcast is more serious about their 2Gbps fiber package. They call it Gigabit Pro, and includes a 2,000$ Juniper ACX2100 router. However you need to be in a very specific footprint, cost 300$ a month and 1000$ up front. Along with MANY other ports, it has 2 10Gbps SFP ports which can work for WAN and LAN so you get the full 2Gbps speed. If curious, there is a good blog on a install here. It's also dedicated fiber unlike Cox's fiber that is shared. It's pretty much a business internet package dressed up as residential service. Apples to oranges but still fascinating.
Blazeice, yes WiderMouthOpen really knows his stuff and has provided some really good information that should be provided from Cox. Not necessarily the technical information (which was very good), but something to the affect of "If this is your set up, this is the only way to get 2 GB via eithernet).
I was thinking about doing the different router route. In that scenrio I would be keeping the Cox Gateway and then plugging the 2.5 Gb port into the Router? This router would act as a managed switch to do the assigning of the IPs and such. Could I get a 2.5 Gb managed switch? Something like NICGIGA 8 Port 2.5G Web Smart Managed Ethernet Switch with 10Gbps SFP+ and still use the Cox modem as the wireless gateway?
I attempted to use an unmananaged switch and it did not work. I got the 2.5 Gb link speed but because it's a dummy switch it doesn't assign IPs to the devices connected to it.
Thanks again for the posts! Both of you all of been very helpful! Much better than the company that we buy this stuff from :(
If you have fiber, the only way to have 2 Gb wired connection is with third party equipment. Is this a case I can bring up to the BBB as Cox can't promise customers the speed they pay for unless they buy extra equipment? Is there an asterisk I missed somewhere the cox stated I had to buy extra equipment?
The fix for Cox for this is to not sell 2 Gb speeds to folks until they get better panoramic WiFi modems that have more than one 2.5 GB port and have techs that can actually test the 2 Gb speeds on site. Their equipment only can test up to 1 Gb
All the models that they provide only have 1 2.5 Gb port. For fiber customers that port is taken up by the uplink to the house. This is cox selling something they are not prepared to support. I have no issues with speed up to the modem. I get 2 Gb consistency, but they should not be selling this service. Everything I've seen tells me that their executives said "oh we can get 2 Gb to the house let's sell them on it! We have the fastest internet in Vegas!"', but obviously can't provide the service that we pay for without extra equipment.
In that scenrio I would be keeping the Cox Gateway and then plugging the 2.5 Gb port into the Router?
No. A gateway(in this context) is the name given to a device that is both a modem and a router. The modem being the device connected to the coaxial input and the router the device connected to the ethernet/wifi portion. When you have fiber, you flip a switch inside the gateway that disables the modem part and just uses the router part, basically turning it into a router. That is because with fiber(typical FTTP fiber) the optical network terminal(ONT) acts as the modem, turning fiber into ethernet. So to replace the gateway, you just need normal stand alone wifi router. You would unplug the ethernet from the 4th orange port on the gateway and plug it into the WAN/Internet port on your new router. It should be plug and play.
Could I get a 2.5 Gb managed switch?
No. You need a router, not a switch. Not sure how much I should explain, but the typical router does several things. First, it uses what is called DHCP to connect to Cox to get a public IP. Then it uses NAT to turn that 1 public IP into many private IP for all your devices. It also has a firewall to protect/monitor traffic going in and out of your network. Not to mention all the other features most routers have like UPnP for handling ports, wifi access point to connect to your wireless devices, etc. A typical switch, even one managed, doesn't do any of those things. It is designed to physically connect ports and share traffic in between them. Most people use switches when they don't have enough ethernet ports on their router. You could probably find a switch that could work, but it would be one designed for business so it would be expensive and not user friendly.
still use the Cox modem as the wireless gateway?
Sorry, that won't work either. By wireless gateway, I think you mean Access point(AP). This lets you wirelessly connect to your network through ethernet. It's like a wifi router but none of the extra features. You might be able to figure out a way to turn off certain things manually in the gateway, but it wouldn't be easy and I looked and didn't see anyone saying they have done it. Also, even if you could, you would still need a router, just not a wifi router.
If you want help picking one out, tell me a little bit about what you need and your budget. Do you want Wifi 6E like the gateway you will be replacing? Is 4 ethernet LAN ports enough? Do you use things like parental control, remote access, DDNS, VLAN, VPN, etc? Basically anything complex? Last, where do you plan on buying it?
TL;DR You need a normal wifi router. It must have a ethernet WAN port and use DHCP. Return the gateway to a Cox store or if it's free, keep it someplace safe incase you ever need to plug it back in for Cox support.
Is there an asterisk I missed somewhere the cox stated I had to buy extra equipment?
I don't know what was shown when you ordered because I can't replicate your order process. Cox fiber isn't available in my area. I did find this, which says:
"For customers served by fiber to the premises technologies, Cox-provided routers/gateways cannot support download and/or upload speeds of more than 940 Mbps per individual compatible device. Customers can reach a total of 2 Gbps via speed test when using multiple compatible devices at the same time. For other network architectures, Cox provided routers/gateways may support up to 2 Gbps download speeds on an individual compatible device."
The way I read that is the gateway can handle 2Gbps of traffic, just not to any one device at a time. They also have a list of 2Gbps Capable Retail Routers here. However, on that same page they list your gateway as capable of 2Gbps. They just mean that in the way they described above, so you make a valid point. The problem is Cox leases the platform they use for internet/TV from Comcast so there pick of gateways is specific to a handful of devices but a few manufactures and none of them offer devices with more then one 2.5Gbps port. That should change soon though as the XB10 and XER10. The XB10 is a Wifi 7/DOCSIS 4.0 gateway while the XER10 is a router specifically designed for fiber(FTTP) service. I am not sure about the XB10, but the XER10 will have two 10Gbps ethernet ports. See here for more info. DOCSIS 4.0 on Comcast is being planned for second half of 2024, so it should be available in some areas of Comcast soon. Cox is usually about 6 months behind Comcast so you might start seeing the XER10 sometime in latter part of 2025? Or Cox might decide to go another route. Either way, you will need to buy your own equipment for the time being or downgrade until they offer fully compatible hardware.
Ohhhh interesting. So if you have coax coming from the pole, the box bolted to your house does nothing and you must have a modem, but with fiber the box bolted into the house (ONT) IS the modem? So just get a router that supports 2 or more Gbps and you're golden? Throw the cox modem/router away?
if you have coax coming from the pole, the box bolted to your house does nothing
It depends. In most places, the box on the side of your house is for what is called your demarcation point, or demarc. This is where the coax connects to your electrical ground for safety. If you have more than 1 coax outlet in your house, it is also where your splitter is. Fiber is seperate. Since it's glass/plastic, it doesn't need to be protected from electrical surges using a ground. If it is armored underground fiber(which can have metal in the fiber's jacket) then sometimes it will be grounded, but I haven't seen it done with the way Cox does it. The fiber comes from outside directly into your ONT, which is usually inside to protect it from the weather. Sometimes there is a fiber terminal box that connects the fat fiber wire on the poles to the thinner fiber(with the green plug) that connects to your ONT and THAT can be outside. What kind of ONT depends too. The newer ones are black and made by Nokia.
So just get a router that supports 2 or more Gbps
Yes, pretty much. It needs to have TWO 2.5Gbps(or faster) ports. One for WAN(the internet) and one for LAN(your computer or switch). Many routers labeled "Multi Gigabit" or say "2.5Gbps" only have one 2.5Gbps port, and that puts you in the same situation you are in now. Check the specs and look at pictures of the ports to make sure. Also, if you have more then 1 PC that you want 2Gbps speed, you will need a 2.5Gbps switch. Last, make sure any computer you want 2Gbps service on has a 2Gbps port/NIC. To check your NIC in Windows press Windows key + X > Device Manager > Network adapter > Look for your ethernet adapter. You can also see it by going to Windows key + R > NCPA.CPL > Look under your ethernet connection. It if isn't obvious, google the name to check it's specs.
Throw the cox modem/router away?
NO! The gateway is Cox property. Even if you aren't paying for it, it's a free lease. If your not paying for it you should keep it so you can hook it up if you ever have problems with the service and need to contact Cox. Cox will only support their gateway. If you are paying for it return it to a Cox store and make sure to GET A RECEIPT. If you forget to return it and cancel service you can be charged 200-300$.
Good find on the small print on what assume is probably on contract when I signed up for this. From what it looks like to me, this protects them from my complaint I might have since they state my exact scenario in the sentence. I had no idea until all the troubleshooting I've done. You'll get a kick out of the stuff I've tried not even thinking about the port on the modem itself.
I did a test with the Cox Wifi up and sure enough I'm getting 2000+ Mb/second, so I was thinking it had to be something on my network (very simple network). I first ordered a usb 2.5 Gb to ethernet adapter and 4 port 2.5 Gb dummy switch (which I needed since the built in NIC card in my PC is limited to 1.0 Gb.) After that I ordered a PCIe 2.5 Gb card, and as you can imagine same results, when I checked the link speed on the NIC settings in Windows it was stating 2.5 Gb so I was thinking it was a Windows issue somewhere. What I realized was the 2.5 Gb was stating the link speed to the next device it was connected to (the 2.5 Gb switch). When I plugged the laptop directly into the available ports it stated 1.0 Gb. I think installed a Linux distro booted into that and did some speed tests and still got 1.0 Gb, so in my head I ruled out Windows. That's when I finally posted on here :)
I will probably downgrade and complain about the issues I had and get the promo price for the 1.0 Gb, since this felt a little scammy to me.
What do you think about something like this ? Sorry the Fiber way of doing things is a bit different for me. You are saying I could just plug the RJ45 into the uplink port of a Wifi Router that has DHCP and it will behave like a normal Wifi router?
What I did before when I had coax at the old house, I could just buy my own Docsis 3.1 Modem and then plug the Coax from the wall to it, call Cox to provision it and then plug it in to the Wifi Router via ethernet. Anything that used Ethernet would be plugged into a dummy switch which would be plugged into the Wifi Router.
In general, that router should technically work but I am not a fan of the Deco line. First thing I notice is it has a very limited manual. Gives almost no info except how to use the app and what the lights mean. Not a good sign. I looked up the manual because I noticed it didn't have a WAN/Uplink port like a normal router. I assume it has some system to detect which port is used for WAN but couldn't find documentation on it. Next, I looked up a review and found this. The first thing that worried me is it seems to use band steering that you can't disable. This combines the 2.4 and 5Ghz band into one name(SSID) which can cause problems with IoT and devices that only connect to 2.4Ghz. Next, I noticed that it has Homeshield, which blocks some of the features behind a paywall and tries to upsell you. See here for more info. Scroll down towards the bottom for what you get and don't get for free. You get a 30 day trial of some of the more advanced features but after that I think it's 90$ a year. Last, do you need Wifi 7? Are you trying to get 2Gbps over Wifi? Wired will always be better than wifi because wifi is half duplex, which means it can't send and receive data at the same time. Wifi also has latency issues compared to wired and cost more. Finally, you need to have Wifi 7 devices to even make use of it, and they aren't very common.
DOCSIS/HFC works different then FTTP/PON. The ONT kind of acts as the modem but is also different. For one, it is included for free with the service and stays with the house. You don't take it with you when you move, even if you move to an area with Cox fiber. Second, it doesn't require a power cycle like a modem does when changing between routers or connecting directly to a PC. It is plug and play. Last, it doesn't have any user interface(atleast customer facing) to check signal levels or logs. That is because the way fiber functions, it either works completely or doesn't work at all. You don't have to worry about weak/bad signal causing slow speeds. You can have weak fiber signal but it should work normally until the signal drops below a certain threshold and then it won't connect. Fiber is better than coax for many reasons. It has more bandwidth, it's not conductive so you don't have to worry about ingress or backfeeding, has less latency, and since the connection from the ONT to the central office isn't powered, it will usually work even when the power is down. That is assuming you have the ONT and your equipment on a battery backup or generator. The only real downside I can think of is fiber is less flexible than coax and more delicate, so you have to be more careful when running it to the ONT if you have to go through walls.
As for using a switch, you only need that if you don't have enough ports, or enough ports of a certain speed, on your router. If you do get a switch, make sure it is 2.5Gbps compatible.
Sorry for the long posts but I like to be as detailed as possible. 😁
no, keep the replies as long as needed. I've learned a lot of you when it comes to Fiber connections. I've had Cox intenet since 1997 and only recently moved into a place that Cox provides a fiber connection. I should have realized it was basiscally plug in play because it's coming into the house via eithernet. I used to have a router/modem that I could access logs on both devices. I could also download another interface for the OS of the router so I can play around with it a little more. Cox also has their 2.4 and 5 Ghz in one network. The only way the TP-link does it (from the reading I've done) is 2.4/5 Ghz in the same network and a sepate 6 Ghz network. They also state that those ports can detect if it's WAN or LAN connection. Not sure how that's done. The other routers I've seen (even other mesh routers from them) had a dedicated WAN port and then 4 others for LAN for example.
I had major ingress issues at my old place, and those logs were very helpful on convincing cox it wasn't my equipment (and a compaint to the BBB). I also noticed that my upload speeds would drop to 1 to 5 Mb per second at specific times of the day. After all that they found some issues on one of the nodes down the street. I have not had any connectivity issues at all with Fiber, and it's been consistantly running at the speeds they adverise (as long as you have the equipment of course)
2.4/5 Ghz in the same network and a sepate 6 Ghz network.
Yes, that is what I read too. You can disable the 5Ghz so the non 6Ghz network is 2.4Ghz only, but that would drastically limit your speed. If all your devices will be either 6Ghz or 2.4Ghz, then you won't have a issue, but very few devices can connect to 6Ghz. 6Ghz also has a lot less range, even less than 5Ghz and almost no wall penetration. It's basically line of sight. Overall, it's only a problem if you have IoT or older wifi devices that can't use 5Ghz. Assuming you didn't mention a issue with the Panoramic router, I assume that isn't a problem.
those ports can detect if it's WAN or LAN connection.
Seems it uses what is called WAN/LAN auto-sensing and as per here, it can be buggy. I didn't read the entire thread(it's 25 pages long) but I did read the first and last page. What happens is when whatever port is being used for WAN loses the ability to get a public IP, it forces all ports to WAN mode, dropping the connection to all other ethernet devices connected to the router. The workaround is to connect certain LAN devices to your Deco mesh node instead of the main router, but that won't work for you since you are getting a single unit. The last page is a request asking to fix the BE85 which is very similar to the BE63, so I think the issue hasn't been patched for either unit yet. I checked the firmware release notes, and there is no mention of a WAN/LAN issue fix. It seems to affect all/most Deco routers with WAN/LAN ports. TP-Link says they are working on a fix to allow you to pick a port for WAN in the user interface/app but I don't think it has been released, at least for the BE63/85. This combined with the other issues I have with the Deco line makes me suggest to look into other options.
As for options, there are many. I am a fan of Asus, and if you are fine with Wifi 6, the RT-AX88u Pro is a good option. There is also the GT-AX6000. Both have dual 2.5Gbps ports though, so should handle the wired part of the network fine. They are also around the same price at ~230$. The next step up is the ZenWiFi Pro ET12, which is Wifi 6E and 349$. Also has dual 2.5Gbps ports and is a great router. Probably what I would get if I wanted to upgrade. If you want Wifi 7 with Asus, there is the ASUS RT-BE96U, but at 639$ it's almost double the price of the Deco BE63. There is the cheaper RT-BE88U(344$) which is Wifi 7, but it doesn't have the 6Ghz band. In general, Wifi 7 with Asus is still at cutting edge prices.
Another good option outside of Asus, is the TP-Link Tri-Band BE9300. Wifi 7 with the 6Ghz band, 1 2.5Gbps WAN port and 4 2.5Gbps LAN ports at 220$ is a steal. See here for review. There is some confusion over the BE9300 vs the BE550. The 550 is supposed to have all 2.5Gbps ports while the 9300 is supposed to have one 2.5Gbps WAN, one 2.5Gbps LAN and three 1Gbps LAN but I couldn't actually find a 9300 anywhere from sale and their site lists the 550 as also being the 9300, but with all 2.5Gbps ports. My guess is they started with two models at different price points but then just released the 550. It uses the same firmware and the specs list all 2.5Gbps ports, so it shouldn't matter. It still has Homeshield, which I think is a money grab, but you can disable the band steering and doesn't have the WAN/LAN auto-sensing bug. Reading Amazon and Newegg reviews mention a issue with WAN disconnecting, but judging by the date of the bad reviews, I think the issue was resolved with a firmware update. TP-link support is still bad, but that goes with most tech support these days. I would still suggest doing some homework, since I am a little suspect at the price point, but hardware wise, it seems to check off all the boxes.
I came across 2 other router considerations. First is the Deco X55 Pro. Wifi 6 and two 2.5Gbps ports. Still uses the auto-sensing feature/bug but much cheaper at 85$ for 1 unit on Amazon. From what someone was telling me here though, it doesn't have the band steering issue. It does use Homeshield though, so some features are locked. There is also the Flint 2. Uses OpenWRT based firmware with a more polished UI. Wifi 6 with one 2.5Gbps WAN port, one 2.5Gbps WAN/LAN port, and 4 1Gbps LAN ports. It's specifically good at multi gigabit dual WAN and ever triple WAN if you consider USB tethering. It also have very good VPN support. The down side is it uses a 3rd party(Bark) for some of it's parental control features, which I guess is becoming the norm. Netgear does it too.
I picked up the TP-Link Deco 63. I'm pretty happy with it so far. It's a much more robust router than the Cox one. The auto Wan/LAN port thing seems to work well so far. I just had one plugged in, powered on the modem, got an IP address then plugged in the second one for the LAN IP.
It's also very fast. I've been doing some speed tests and get from 400 to 600 Mb in most of the rooms in the house. My phone is a Wifi 7 defice that supports MIMO and it's getting 1.5 Gb next to the modem. I'm also getting the 2.2 Gb via eithernet. I'll keep you updated if I find out any issues with it. I really apprecate your knowlegable posts, you really helped me out with this issue.
